I found this to be very interesting. Earlier this year, iVillage came up with a bunch of cities that are good for women. I would really like to know more about their methodology. What's really interesting, is this list is broken down by age categories.
Of course, San Francisco, CA and Palo Alto, CA made the cut. And, as we know, SF is full of man-children. I don't really think this is a good list.
It's really unfortunate too. I think SF is a wonderful city with a lot of intelligent people. There is so much to do with a significant other. However, I agree with you. It's full of man children who live with roommates until they are 45 and do not want to settle down. It is so frustrating for us women...
ReplyDeleteSF would be the best city if the guys/dating scenario was better. Anonymous, do you think you'll move? If so, where would you go?
DeleteI'm not going to go anywhere. I bought a condo last year and I absolutely love it. I also love my job and the Bay Area in general. I lived in Chicago for four years and while it was nice, nothing compares to SF.
DeleteI'm in my mid 30s now and feeling more discouraged than ever that I'm going to meet anyone. I'm an accomplished professional and have done well for myself. It's sad how this world works...
How was the dating scene when you were in Chicago? I know two women who moved out of SF and found their now husbands within months. One was in her late 30s and moved back to NY (I hear her husband does quite well). The other was in her mid 30s and moved to DC.
DeleteSorry if you've already said this, how long have you been in SF?
I have been in SF since 2010, and lived in the South Bay before that for a few years. I didn't date at all when I was in Chicago because I was in medical school and didn't have time for it. I regret leaving Chicago because I'm sure I would have found someone there. I'm so frustrated with these loser SF guys. I have met successful men online including doctors, lawyers, businessmen. But it's always the same ole same ole. They think they are hot shit and can get anyone. They never want to commit. I just am not in the position to move anymore because I bought my condo and my job is going really well.
DeleteHow was the dating world when you in the South Bay? As we both know, San Jose, Palo Alto, etc are always on the "best single" lists. I wonder if the South Bay guys are just as douchey as the SF city guys.
DeleteAnonymous, as a former Chicago resident, I can agree that while dating was a bit easier in the midwest, I much prefer SF living.
DeleteI don't know of any other city in the US that is full of so many guys in their 30s who live like frat bros and go through women like paper cups!
Hey Sabrina, do you like SF living more because of the weather? Work life balance? Etc?
DeleteReally not impressed with all the frat boys. Do you think NY is better than SF in terms of dating/guys?
I like SF living more because sheer number of transplants the city draws in. I was tired of living in a place where everyone is from nearby, went to a neighboring Midwestern college, and moved to Chicago. I also love how active the city is - hiking, biking, sports leagues, etc.
DeleteSo many transplants out here. Where are all the east coast, southern, and midwest boys hiding?
DeleteI'm curious. I haven't been following you long enough to be familiar with all the guys you've written about here. Are most of them fairly well off financially? I'm curious because you throw around the man-child term a lot. I'm wondering if there's a correlation here. I ran across a few young tech guys at a gathering in my building and that term popped right into my mind while I was speaking with them.
ReplyDeleteAnd to Anonymous, I'm almost 40 and I live with a roommate. But that's only because my girlfriend of 5 years left me. So just remember that we aren't all in permanent party mode. Life gets complicated at times and we all do what we must.....especially when rent is same damn high!! :D
Hey J, you are correct, all of the guys I've talked about are well off (minimum $250K/year salaries). Many of the guys I've gone out with still think it's awesome get get drunk to the point of blacking out/vomiting three nights a week. They may own their own apartments in San Francisco, but are not trying to fill them with a wife or kids. Instead, it's party central and very frat houseish. There is also this mentality of "finding better." I have one very successful friend, he brings around really great women, and always writes them off for immaterial reasons (her pinky toenail looks weird). He is a great guy, but these girls were pretty awesome too, so? Based on what I hear from my guy friends, they all think they are hot sht. Maybe it's because a lot of them have pretty nice salaries?
DeleteThe young tech guys you know are well off and man-children? How young were they?
How do you find such successful men? I always end up going out with the men who make less than 100 K (I make more than 200K myself) and you can see the discrepancy. It's hard to get used to a certain lifestyle on your own when you can afford it, and then go out with someone who doesn't. It's unfortunate that the men who make the same amount as us behave like such children...
DeleteI typically will not go out with a guy unless he has a graduate degree or works in a Sales/Business development role at a large tech company. I've met a lot of them at parties, through friends, and online. For online, my rule is never contact a guy first; I find that they are more interested when they have to get the ball rolling.
DeleteSince you do well, how about dating coworkers (in a different department) or their friends?
I dated a coworker, but it didn't work out. I work at a place where EVERYONE is married or in a relationship. You are absolutely right. I should stop lowering my standards and stick to what I am looking for: a man with a graduate degree who makes the same as, similar to, more more than me. I don't think it would work out otherwise...Might as well stay single in the meantime and enjoy what I have!
DeleteMan, I can't figure out how to keep my posts straight. lol
DeleteSo forgive me if this was talked about before. But when exactly do your standards come into play. Will you talk to a guy who you know doesn't have a graduate degree or the good job just to see what he's like? Or do you not even bother until your standards are met?
Anonymous, I don't really know how this works...would it be very unprofessional if you dated a patient? Any cute guys in your apartment building?
DeleteJ, let me think about this. If it's online, I won't even talk to a guy until standards are met (online, it's easy to see what someone does, what degrees they hold, etc). In person, I'll chit chat with someone and figure out what I need to know within 5-7 minutes. I'm at the point where I don't want to waste my time and I would much rather have a great night with friends or by myself than go out with someone I know won't make the cut. Hope this doesn't sound too harsh. What is your process with the ladies?
Oh not harsh at all, I'm not trying to judge or anything. You do what you do.
DeleteI came across your blog and I thought it would be a good place to get a different point of view on dating. It's helpful and interesting. Sometimes I do feel like I need to point out that there are some good guys still out there in SF though. :D
As for my process, I don't think I can honestly decide within 5-7 minutes if I'm into a girl. I'm convinced that no one shows you who they really are on the first or even the second date, much less some chit chat time at a party.
So if the first date goes well and a second date gets set, I'll try to maintain some casual texting until our next meeting. I think of this as a way of forming an initial bond. If she doesn't seem interested in chatting and I rarely hear from her between dates, I pretty much know it's not going to work out. The second dates are always the key date for me. If things get past that one, I know that there could be something there. But not many of my dates have made it past the second....unless you count the purely sexual relationships I've had. But even those burn out quickly.
Now, I'm off to get ready for a first date. Wish me luck!
Hey J, hope you had a great date! How did you two meet?
DeleteI think I saw a thing on Discovery Channel a while back about people knowing if they want to see someone again within 30 seconds. Of course, this doesn't take into account personality. Every time I've talked myself into going out with a guy even though the first 5-7 minutes was unimpressive, I really regretted it. Do you find that (in the long run) the girls you keep an open mind about are pretty okay or not really?
She was fun to hang out with but there wasn't any physical chemistry. Besides, she didn't want kids and I do....so kind of deal breaker. I told her this afternoon that I wasn't interested in her romantically but I would love to be friends. Unfortunately she wasn't interested in that....I tried though!
DeleteI met her on OKC. She actually contacted me. I generally don't respond to women who contact me because they are usually in their 40s or 50's. But she is in her late 20's and I thought she was kind of interesting.
As for being open minded. Quite honestly it has more to do with the fact that it's kind of difficult for a guy to be choosy on OKC in SF. Unless he's got a grad degree and a six figure salary. ;)
Sorry there wasn't any chemistry. Hmm, had no idea there were 40 and 50 year old women on OkC!
DeleteYeah, I figured as much. People have to go through some sort of hardships in their lives otherwise they just end up jaded and entitled......well some people can make it through OK if they have good influences around them. IMO
ReplyDeleteSo the guys I met had to be in their late 20's early 30's. The way they talked about women and bragged about their jobs was pretty disgusting. I'm surprised that my neighbor is friends with them since he's a really cool guy.
I totally agree! I think SF offers a very easy life, which is why many people are entitled, don't know how to handle difficulties, and don't know how to behave.
DeleteThese guys have many options in the women department? Wow. Well, I guess that makes sense, a lot of ladies overlook personality for money.
I think that is the problem. There is an inverse relationship between money and personality.
DeleteThere are a lot of douchey rich guys in every city, but it seems like it's worse out here because the guys don't realize their situation is not unique. For example, in NY, a rich investment banker realizes there are a lot of other rich investment bankers he has to compete with. Out here, a rich tech guy doesn't seem to realize there are other rich tech guys he needs to compete with.
DeleteJust curious, AG and Anonymous, if you met a guy who did not meet your degree/income requirements, but was otherwise great, would you ever date him?
ReplyDeleteThe most amazing man I have ever met doesn't have a college degree...but maybe it's different in SF. I live in a rural area.
Nope. It would never work out. Different values and you get used to a certain lifestyle that the man can't provide. You would end up resentful and it wouldn't work out in the end.
ReplyDeleteInteresting. I have found the opposite. But I have also been married (to a guy with an advanced degree) and divorced. Now there's other things far more important to me. It's good to know your dealbreakers, though.
DeleteHey Lynn, glad you found a good guy.
DeleteI wouldn't date a guy that didn't meet my income requirements. Income is a big deal because I don't want a guy mooching off of me, I feel it's very emasculating and I know I would see him as less of a man.
What is your income requirement?
DeleteDepends on how old he is. Money will get him a chance and only that. One of the guys I have mentioned makes $600K+ and still has no shot
DeleteNYC is terrible! And the men aren't competing for women - it's the opposite. It's a city where new women enter every year aspiring to be models. I hated dating there. I was told several times I was too fat to be girlfriend material by guys who admitted I wasn't actually fat.
ReplyDeleteIncome for me wasn't important b/c if you're already reaching your standard on your own, you don't need to worry about a guy's salary. I'm curious as to how you know these guys make so much? A lot of important-sounding jobs don't pay that well. My fiancé and I had been dating a while before I found out how much he made. He makes less than me. No big deal. Love this man!
Wow, NYC guys would tell you that you were fat? That's really rude. I know a lot if people who met online and got married in NY.
DeleteAre you currently in SF? How did you meet your fiancé?
Guys I meet tend to tell me their salary within the first ten minutes. They slip it in like, "I went to HBS, just bought my place, and make $350k a year."
I'm in the Bay Area (just outside SF). I met him on OKCupid - I posted about it before. He was the one I "lowered my standards" for (ie no grad school, more than 5 yrs older than me).
ReplyDeleteI am shocked that you meet people who actually tell you that! I think that's indicative of a really shallow, horrible shell of a person. I also think that's pretty rude. Then again, the Bay Area is full of men who are somewhere along the autism spectrum.
"Then again, the Bay Area is full of men who are somewhere along the autism spectrum."
DeleteHAH!!
Lol, I agree! For years, thought it was social awkwardness from being nerds...autism totally makes sense.
DeleteI don't mind when they blurt out their salaries, makes it easier to move to the next one
Agreed! Seems like there are many men with aspergers around here.
ReplyDelete